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Intermittent Hormome Therapy

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 14:26

Well, my hormone holiday is coming to an end.http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif

Saw my onco yesterday and as PSA is now up to 15.5 and rising at a faster rate,  I'm due to start cyproterone tablets on 22nd Aug, then have a Zoladex jab on 29th.

So this time round, my body has been free of the drug for 18 months.

It's nowhere near as long as my very first 'holiday' of 44 months (2007 -2010), but I certainly feel better for the break.

Happy with that!http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif

 

All the best,


George

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 14:41
George

Life is good an 18 month break is better than many would get at outset let alone 10 years down the road.

I am happy that you are happy

Xxxx

Mo

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 18:16

Here's to the next holiday!  May it be soon in coming!

flexi

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 18:39

Get that PSA knocked down George so you can enjoy a further holiday

Bri

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 19:44

George may this time on be short. Don't forget your next target of 15 years.

Good luck

Ray

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 20:01
As Mo says, happy you are happy, :) Janet, xx
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 15:48

Very very pleased for you George , and for your great spirit which should help anyone in this situation.
Best wishes for the future
Chris

If life gives you lemons , then make lemonade

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 16:06

Great news George, shame the same can not be said about your football team http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-laughing.gif

See you soon mate

Si x

Don't deny the diagnosis; try to defy the verdict
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 16:17

Hi George,

That sounds really great news.  Couldn't happen to a nicer person.

Good luck for the rest of the treatment.

Take care.

Steve

 

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:03

Great news. So pleased for you George !

 

Fiona.

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:10

Nice one George. Very good news. Keep clocking those years up.

Ray

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:18

So, so happy to see this news George - I am almost excited enough to have a tipple on your behalf xxxxx

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 18:19
Great news both results going in the right direction

Arthur

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 19:05

Awesome!  Here's to the next holiday!

Flexi

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 19:41
Cracking news George xxx
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 19:44
Great news George, hope for us all. Kev

Dream like you have forever, live like you only have today Avatar is me doing the 600 mile Camino de Santiago May 2019

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 20:00

Hi George,

Well done, I don't know about you, but I have found my second spell on HT a little easier to cope with than the first, it might be that I am on Prostrap at the moment as opposed to Zoladex, or that I am used to it now, but appart from the odd hot flush it ain't been to bad.

My last Prostrap is due at the end of November so I am looking forward to salacious thoughts returning in the new year, whether or not I will be able to do anything about them is of course a different matter!

As for footy, whilst I wouldn't wish your lot bad fortune, it is nice to see lots of teams competing to keep the Canaries off the bottom, most seasons we don't have too much trouble securing a place in the bottom 3, and if the inevitable happens life in the Chapionship isn't that bad because you get the chance to beat Ipswich!

:)

Dave

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 20:05
George

Lovely to hear your excellent news

Maureen x

"You're braver than you believe, stronger than you seem and smarter than you think." A A Milne
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 21:08

Great news George....your posts also offer hope and inspiration to others

Bri

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 23:14

Originally Posted by: Online Community Member

Si mocks my football team (and they've deserved it!)http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif, but the word is they won't be going for 30 draws this season, just wins!

 

And Lyn, I'm surprised you didn't dash for a tipple last night when you saw Newcastle replace Sunderland at the bottom of the premiership.

The Tyne and Wear sides would drive anyone to drink.http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif

 

Good thing you and I are tee-total, innit?http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif

 

You have ruined my evening - I have been in the depths of Somerset and had no idea we were bottom .... this is a very bad time to be a Toon fan

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 16 Sep 2015 at 12:00
George

Fantastic news from one of life's nicest people.

I baked the magic muffins for my brother to eat at half time but they didn't work on Sunday. Liverpool continue to frustrate had a word with John Henry while I was in Boston told him he needs to buy a striker ...he said his number one team have one but he plays for the red sox. I sometimes think we could do with a baseball player! !!

Xx

Mo

User
Posted 16 Sep 2015 at 12:44

Hi George,

Don't ask me why, but I always feel a little guilty about taking up doctor's time, so I don't always ask the right questions, least wise once I get home from the doctors I often remember the questions I meant to ask!

Your points about Prostrap and low HB are interesting.

I had the HDR Brachytherapy in February, and when I went for my 'routine annual diabetes' check in March the nurse gave me a good bollocking about not always taking my tablets, the perils of diabetes etc, so I thought seeing as how PCa was on the back burner I would concentrate on sorting the diabetes, amongst other things I went on a low carb diet sort of 'Atkins meets Jane Plant' as much meat, beans, onions and greens, and salad as I fancied but not much else.

By July I was getting a bit if the intermittent bowel problems, taking liver salts four or five times a week, so I went to see the GP, its a group practice so she was new to me, she sent off blood to test, I am not sure what for, she phoned back with the results, said my bowels would be fine if I left the liver salts alone, but she went on to say that my haemoglobin was low, not quite anaemic but low.

It was only after the phone call that I realised she probablly didn't know I had had brachytherapy in February, and I guess that the radiation must knock back the haemoglobin.  thinking about it now I guess some of you more knowledgable blokes will say I am talking bollocks, but it sort of made sense to me at the time.

Since then I have had the prostate infection and been put on Tamsulosin, fallen over and had an ambulance ride because my blood presure was too low etc all of which I have covered in other posts.

The point is I have had lots of appointments recently all with different doctors, they have sorted me out, I no longer on blood pressure tablets because I no longer have high blood pressure, my diabetes tablets have been cut down by half because my blood sugar is low, and come my next test in december I may be officially not diabetic at all.

But with all of this going on I quite forgot to ask about haemoglobin, from what you say it could be linked to the Prostrap?

As I said, December will be my last Prostrap, least wise for a few years, so I don't suppose I will know what caused the haemoglobin problem unless it persisists, and I guess with all the tests I have had recently they will have looked at that, wouldn't they?  They would have told me if it was still low wouldn't they?  Or am I being naive?  

:)

Dave

User
Posted 16 Sep 2015 at 14:51

Pleased to see your results George.

 

You're certainly giving the old cancer a run for its money.

 

Keep up the good work.

 

All rhe  best

 

Sandra

We can't control the winds - but we can adjust our sails
User
Posted 16 Sep 2015 at 17:03

Hi George,

Had my bloods done today and on my results it says

Haemoglobin range 130-170

Red blood range 4.40-5.80

This might just be the east midlands range as you lot are tougher up north http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-laughing.gif

Don't deny the diagnosis; try to defy the verdict
User
Posted 17 Sep 2015 at 16:33

Hi there George really pleased to read your news.

I don’t know where you get the courage or guts to take these hormone breaks. I’m presently on Prostap, have been for the past 9 months and things are going well, much better than on Casodex; however I’m really suffering badly from hot flushes. They keep me awake most of the night. I can’t remember them being this bad when I first started on Prostap.

As you know I’ve had both RP & RT way back in 2006, my PSA start to climb in 2010, which is when I joined this forum looking for help. My PSA peaked at 0.94 in Dec 2012, at which point I started on hormone treatment, the previous 6 years I didn’t do a thing. I thought that I’d got away with it and was on the cure trail, no such luck. Whilst on the HT my PSA has behaved pretty well. But I feel that I should try a break like you, but I simply haven’t the guts.

What was it that triggered you to stop the HT??

Apart from the hot flushes I feel just great, life couldn’t be much better.

Cheers,
Stu

User
Posted 17 Sep 2015 at 20:51

Hi George,

Thanks for taking the time to give such a detailed reply. I'll refect on what you say, getting a CT scan isn't so easy here. My last scans were a PET and bone scan in Jan 2013, the bone was clear, but the PET revealed a small tumour, which was the start of my HT. To be perfectly honest I'd be scared to have another scan, I've been burying my head in the sand and relying soley on my low PSA results. I'll bring this up with my Urologist on Saturday. You must have a marvellous relationship with your Oncologist.

Cheers
Stu

User
Posted 17 Sep 2015 at 21:54
Hi George

good result and long may it continue

Carol x

User
Posted 17 Sep 2015 at 22:25

Hi George,
So pleased IHT is working out well for you - no reason to change a good strategy.

Barry
User
Posted 18 Sep 2015 at 13:10

Thanks, Carol and Barry.

Yep, I hope I don't have to change strategy for a while yet.

'If it ain't broke, don't fix it'.http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-wink.gif

 

STU?

You can't get a much better scan than a PET scan. I wish I could have one of those at my hospital!

Just a note: I never take a break from HT until I've seen a full year of PSA <0.1.

Too scary for me to try stopping the injections too early.

 

Good Luck,

 

George

User
Posted 18 Sep 2015 at 16:51
Dear George

First of all can I say thank you for posting your story. It has been really helpful, reassuring and informative for me and probably many others who look to this site for help.

Perhaps you ( and others) could comment upon our situation, in view of your experience of hormone 'holidays'.

In brief my OH was diagnosed in November 2011 as G 7 (3+4) N1 M0 PSA 3.6 Aged 61 at the time.

He started on the hormone medication Prostap January 2012 and had RT to prostate and pelvis autumn 2012, 37 fractions on IMRT machine.

he also entered stampede trial and had 2 years abiraterone. Completed this Summer 2014.

PSA dropped below 0.1 and tested 1-3 monthly since that time, remains at that level.

After now 3.5 years on Prostap the Onco has suggested that we stop taking it to see what happens.

Full bone scans were done initially upon diagnoses and repeated October 2014.

We were initially told that the hormone therapy would be long term, and sort of assumed that this would be forever. Is this the case normally that the Prostap is stopped after this length of time?

Any information would be welcome, as we are concerned about stopping it, but obviously worried about resistance to it too.

Alison

User
Posted 18 Sep 2015 at 17:17

Dear Alison,

 

In my personal opinion, the oncologist is on the ball.

Your OH could probably benefit hugely from a break.

Since the oncologist himself has mentioned it, he must think so too.

However, since it's almost a year since the last scans, I would ask him to arrange another lot before trying the intermittent path.

One good thing is, if he gets the all clear to stop HT, then monthly PSA tests would allow him to keep a close eye on the number, and

if it rises too quickly he can go straight back to treatment.

Your oncologist would know when it was time to act.

 

All the very best,

 

George

Edited by member 18 Sep 2015 at 17:18  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 19 Sep 2015 at 18:04

Hello George,
Just to wish you a smooth ride with IHT. Also to mention that Cyproterone Acetate is a steroidal antiandrogen and it can be metabolized to an androgen. It is fine to avoid the initial testosterone surge at the start of HT but you should keep an eye on your PSA drop. Also consider adding Avodart or Proscar to inhibit DHT. As always it is great to hear from you! We are all mourning Rob on our chat group...
Best regards,
RalphV

Edited by member 19 Sep 2015 at 18:05  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 21 Sep 2015 at 18:20

Hi

Dave - George mentioned my hormone holidays in his posting on 16 September. For anyone not familiar with all of this the option of taking breaks in HT may be described as “Intermittent Hormone Therapy” or “Hormone Holidays”. When IHT first started a number of years ago the practice for men who had been on HT for a considerable time was generally successive periods of “6 months off  treatment then 6 months on”  repeated as necessary subject to an acceptable PSA levels and scans when appropriate. The expectation was that this may reduce the side effects from androgen suppression but subject to his PSA level not increasing above an agreed figure.

IHT then evolved into Hormone Holidays as an option for some men - same idea but for variable periods depending on the man’s past treatments. In other words you come off HT until you have to start again because of a rising PSA level.

The NICE recommendation for a man who is having an off period from HT is that HT should be restarted when his PSA reaches 10 or when symptoms reappear. See Section 4.1 of Nice clinical guideline 175: Prostate cancer: diagnosis and treatment.  

 In my case I had hot flushes over the years but the main side effect was  loss of muscle strength. Prostap has always kept my PSA very low which meant I had no trouble starting a hormone holiday. I stayed off treatment until my PSA increased to a double figure. At that point each time I had a DRE, CT scan and a Bone scan all of which were clear with no evidence of disease. This is classed as a biochemical relapse. When I started HT again my PSA dropped very low and remained there for a number of years each time. I am now on my 3rd hormone holiday and in my 16th year since diagnosis. My Hormone Holidays have been 3 years 1 month, 4 years 3 months and my current HH stated in March 2014.You can see the numbers and dates in my profile.    

Stu – you mentioned that you were reluctant to take a break from your HT. This is a personal choice but one option is to have monthly PSA tests when you are off treatment. You will find an earlier thread about using cyproterone to reduce hot flushes at the link below.

http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/posts/t10994-Use-of-cyproterone-acetate#post134238

I hope this is useful.

Alan

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User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 14:41
George

Life is good an 18 month break is better than many would get at outset let alone 10 years down the road.

I am happy that you are happy

Xxxx

Mo

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 18:16

Here's to the next holiday!  May it be soon in coming!

flexi

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 18:39

Get that PSA knocked down George so you can enjoy a further holiday

Bri

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 19:44

George may this time on be short. Don't forget your next target of 15 years.

Good luck

Ray

User
Posted 01 Jul 2015 at 20:01
As Mo says, happy you are happy, :) Janet, xx
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 15:30

Dear Guys and Goddesses,

I had bloods done yesterday and got the results today.

Intermittent HT is working well for me yet again.http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-smile.gif

 

In just 4 weeks my PSA has dropped from 21.9 to 7.16 while testosterone has shot down from 12.9 to 0.9.

This through just the 3 weeks course of Cyproterone and a Zoldadex injection done on 27th Aug.

It's always a worrying time for me when I end a hormone holiday and resume treatment.

I always wonder, will it still work?

Well, for the fourth time in ten and a half years it has.

I know I'll never beat this cancer, but I will take it to a high scoring draw!http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-smile.gif

 

George

 

 

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 15:48

Very very pleased for you George , and for your great spirit which should help anyone in this situation.
Best wishes for the future
Chris

If life gives you lemons , then make lemonade

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 16:06

Great news George, shame the same can not be said about your football team http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-laughing.gif

See you soon mate

Si x

Don't deny the diagnosis; try to defy the verdict
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 16:17

Hi George,

That sounds really great news.  Couldn't happen to a nicer person.

Good luck for the rest of the treatment.

Take care.

Steve

 

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:03

Great news. So pleased for you George !

 

Fiona.

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:10

Nice one George. Very good news. Keep clocking those years up.

Ray

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:18

So, so happy to see this news George - I am almost excited enough to have a tipple on your behalf xxxxx

"Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Soren Kierkegaard

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 17:47

Si mocks my football team (and they've deserved it!)http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif, but the word is they won't be going for 30 draws this season, just wins!

 

And Lyn, I'm surprised you didn't dash for a tipple last night when you saw Newcastle replace Sunderland at the bottom of the premiership.

The Tyne and Wear sides would drive anyone to drink.http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif

 

Good thing you and I are tee-total, innit?http://community.prostatecanceruk.org/editors/tiny_mce/plugins/emoticons/img/smiley-frown.gif

Edited by member 15 Sep 2015 at 17:48  | Reason: Not specified

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 18:19
Great news both results going in the right direction

Arthur

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 19:05

Awesome!  Here's to the next holiday!

Flexi

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 19:41
Cracking news George xxx
User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 19:44
Great news George, hope for us all. Kev

Dream like you have forever, live like you only have today Avatar is me doing the 600 mile Camino de Santiago May 2019

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 20:00

Hi George,

Well done, I don't know about you, but I have found my second spell on HT a little easier to cope with than the first, it might be that I am on Prostrap at the moment as opposed to Zoladex, or that I am used to it now, but appart from the odd hot flush it ain't been to bad.

My last Prostrap is due at the end of November so I am looking forward to salacious thoughts returning in the new year, whether or not I will be able to do anything about them is of course a different matter!

As for footy, whilst I wouldn't wish your lot bad fortune, it is nice to see lots of teams competing to keep the Canaries off the bottom, most seasons we don't have too much trouble securing a place in the bottom 3, and if the inevitable happens life in the Chapionship isn't that bad because you get the chance to beat Ipswich!

:)

Dave

User
Posted 15 Sep 2015 at 20:05
George

Lovely to hear your excellent news

Maureen x

"You're braver than you believe, stronger than you seem and smarter than you think." A A Milne
 
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